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Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 12:58 PM
Disclaimer: I am not an attorney nor am I giving legal advice. Do your own research and do not rely on this post.

I feel obligated to post this as a possible public safety issue as a member of this forum and gardening community. This should be common sense but I read in a post in this forum that someone’s friend found old deteriorated dynamite in a house and planted it in her tomato planting holes!!

Farmers at one time could simply go down to their local hardware store and purchase dynamite, detonator cord and detonators (blasting caps) for blowing up stumps and beaver dams. You may very well find explosives materials that have been lying around for decades. Things have become a bit more complicated. In most cases the possession of explosive materials requires a Federal, State and possibly local permit or license. Explosives materials must be properly stored in a storage magazine that meets Federal and most likely state requirements. Dynamite is considered a high explosive and must be stored in an approve high explosives magazine. Burying it in the ground does NOT meet storage requirements.

Old deteriorated dynamite presents a particularly dangerous situation. When it sweats that is nitroglycerin which is extremely dangerous and unstable. In the situation described in this forum where someone buried the old deteriorated dynamite in the ground – it is possible for that old dynamite to explode with a shovel hitting it in the ground! I have seen situations where old military ordinance buried for 60+ years were still active. Most often it is just detonated in the ground where it lies as it is just too dangerous to move.

In additon to physical injury or death of yourself or a loveone - If you find explosives in this manner and you fail to promptly report them to the proper authorities you may be placing yourself in serous legal jeopardy under Federal and state law not to mention civil liability.

Bottom line - If you find explosives materials or anything that looks like explosive materials report them immediately to your local authorities. Your local police and/or sheriffs department will either have a bomb squad or access to one. Do not attempt to move the explosives materials yourself. It could be a fatal mistake.

If just one person reads this and knows of a similar situation possibly a serious injury or death may be prevented. Again this should be common sense.

SpaceAge
February 13th, 2011, 01:06 PM
yeah , pretty much , dynamite and bee-hives ... call a pro ...

the next guy with the rototiller might be toast

redneckplanter
February 13th, 2011, 01:08 PM
but will dynamite kill svbs?grins

gulfcoastguy
February 13th, 2011, 01:18 PM
No Red, we need nukes for that.

bughunter99
February 13th, 2011, 01:18 PM
EZZ why would someone do that? What would be the benefit?

jbosmith
February 13th, 2011, 01:20 PM
but will dynamite kill svbs?grins

Pretty sure they find nitroglycerin to be an aphrodisiac.

redneckplanter
February 13th, 2011, 01:22 PM
rotfl ya'll

MVNewf
February 13th, 2011, 01:34 PM
If I had found those sticks of dynomite I would have stuck them under my EX's behind and lit a match :D {{{{ No, that was NOT a shooting star, that was Ted on his way out the door }}}}} :D

Jeffster83
February 13th, 2011, 03:28 PM
There was a thread last week about someone wanting to remove an asparagus crown, to replace it with an aster. Maybe the moderators should link these two threads. ;)

Mook
February 13th, 2011, 03:52 PM
If I had found those sticks of dynomite I would have stuck them under my EX's behind and lit a match :D {{{{ No, that was NOT a shooting star, that was Ted on his way out the door }}}}} :D

Ummm...a match wouldn't work...you would need a blasting cap...:D

jbosmith
February 13th, 2011, 03:54 PM
Ummm...a match wouldn't work...you would need a blasting cap...:D

If it had nitro on it, all she'd really have to do is throw it at his behind and hope it didn't blow up before it got there...

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 04:16 PM
We can all have some fun but there are actually people out there that still seem oblivious to the dangers of explosives materials they find. One other item - There is also a hidden danger with dynamite – noxious fumes. Dynamite when stable gives off noxious fumes and when unstable they become much worse. In an enclosed area these can be very dangerous and even fatal to some individuals that have medical issues such as high blood pressure or respiratory problems. Persons entering enclosed areas containing dynamite should were respiratory masks designated for that type of exposure. When that is not possible at the very minimum the area should be well aired out to help disperse the fumes. I have had personal experience with this issue. Upon entering an enclosed area that contained dynamite I immediately felt as if something had shot though my sinuses and got a little light headed. I was not disabled though. Later that day I got what is termed a “Dynamite” headache. It was a migraine headache that was terrible. I was told drinking caffeine was one remedy. It helped a little but not much. Take my word on this one – you do not want that type of pain. Simply do not approach or handle explosives. Call the experts. OK I have said my piece and off my soapbox. My post was simply for information purposes.

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 04:22 PM
EZZ why would someone do that? What would be the benefit?

I cannot answer that question. Lack of knowledge would be my guess.

Mook
February 13th, 2011, 04:27 PM
We can all have some fun but there are actually people out there that still seem oblivious to the dangers of explosives materials they find. One other item - There is also a hidden danger with dynamite – noxious fumes. Dynamite when stable gives off noxious fumes and when unstable they become much worse. In an enclosed area these can be very dangerous and even fatal to some individuals that have medical issues such as high blood pressure or respiratory problems. Persons entering enclosed areas containing dynamite should were respiratory masks designated for that type of exposure. When that is not possible at the very minimum the area should be well aired out to help disperse the fumes. I have had personal experience with this issue. Upon entering an enclosed area that contained dynamite I immediately felt as if something had shot though my sinuses and got a little light headed. I was not disabled though. Later that day I got what is termed a “Dynamite” headache. It was a migraine headache that was terrible. I was told drinking caffeine was one remedy. It helped a little but not much. Take my word on this one – you do not want that type of pain. Simply do not approach or handle explosives. Call the experts. OK I have said my piece and off my soapbox. My post was simply for information purposes.

That nitro headache hurts...I use gloves when handling the stuff...shot a few sticks in my day.Fire in the hole.

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 04:51 PM
Mook

"That nitro headache hurts...I use gloves when handling the stuff...shot a few sticks in my day.Fire in the hole."

Fire in the hole!! I haven't heard that for a few years. Yep gloves should also be used. I am now retired and just trying to become a competent gardener. When I saw the post it struck a nerve and I simply tried to give people information on the possible problems and issues. Unfortunately you read about people finding old explosives all the time - especially dynamite. Companies now are going away from dynamite into the emulsions that are much safer without all the bio hazard issues. Of course you still must have a booster to set off the emulsions.

MVNewf
February 13th, 2011, 05:23 PM
Ezzrider...I live on an island off the coast of MA...during WW11 one of the tiny islands about 1 mile out from me was used as target practice by our government. Still to this day some 70 years later, live bombs wash up on our beaches....people are suppose to contact the police when they wash up, but many keep them. Tourists find them, kids find them. Just last week the government finally is getting serious about this before someone gets killed by one of the still active bombs rolling around the ocean floor and washing up on our beaches...that island that is 1 mile away (Nomans Land) has been banned from people ever going to it since WW11...only birds and seals there. Here is a front page story from just 2 days ago in our local island paper....
http://www.mvgazette.com/article.php?28967

jbosmith
February 13th, 2011, 05:31 PM
Google Maps lists an airfield on that island. I'm not sure I'd want to land a plane there!

MVNewf
February 13th, 2011, 05:42 PM
QUOTE jbosmithGoogle
Maps lists an airfield on that island. I'm not sure I'd want to land a plane there!


Noooooo, that is Katama Airfield. That is a grass landing field for small privately owned planes, no commercial airline planes can land there.... They also do airplane tours of the island from the airfield. Nice restaurant there to. Pretty cool to watch planes and copters come and go from it....it is right next to the ocean to :) if the plane miss the grassy runway, can always make a splash in the drink....:eek:

jbosmith
February 13th, 2011, 05:47 PM
I was referring to 'No mans land navy airfield' on the southwest corner of the big bang island! It doesn't actually look like an airfield, but who knows.

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 05:49 PM
Ezzrider...I live on an island off the coast of MA...during WW11 one of the tiny islands about 1 mile out from me was used as target practice by our government. Still to this day some 70 years later, live bombs wash up on our beaches....people are suppose to contact the police when they wash up, but many keep them. Tourists find them, kids find them. Just last week the government finally is getting serious about this before someone gets killed by one of the still active bombs rolling around the ocean floor and washing up on our beaches...that island that is 1 mile away (Nomans Land) has been banned from people ever going to it since WW11...only birds and seals there. Here is a front page story from just 2 days ago in our local island paper....
http://www.mvgazette.com/article.php?28967

I read a bit of the story. Err from what I read without personal knowledge - Unfortunately that is not all that uncommon. There are old bombing ranges all around the US that still have buried military ordinance. The Army Corps of Engineers contracts with private companies to remove the explosives (most often detonated in place). There is an whole cottage industry in explosives or ordinance removal. I believe a simple INTERNET search would reveal this. A lot of these "old bombing ranges" are now subdivisions where people live. :eek::eek::eek:

skiracer
February 13th, 2011, 05:49 PM
That nitro headache hurts...I use gloves when handling the stuff...shot a few sticks in my day.Fire in the hole.

I have that license to blast in several states and the stuff can be dangerous. the rules and regulations governing using the stuff, obtaining it, storing it, and documenting your use of it are very stringent. one violation and they will take your license from you and that will be the end of that. I have been the blaster on numberous projects up and down the eastern coastline and in all those years of obtaining it and using it I have never come across any of it lying around undocumented or not in a concrete storage hut. it is almost beyond my comprehension that anyone who has gone thru the process of obtaining a license to blast would leave the explosive lying around out in the open.
the fumes will give you a terrible migraine headache and the best thing to get rid of the headache is to take a stick and open one end, scoop out a small chaw, and place it like a chaw of chewing tobacco under your lower lip between your gum and your lip. the headache will disappear in a short period of time. depending upon your tolerance, which differs from one person to another, the best thing to do is to stay away from the fumes after a shot has been blown. it needs to be set off for you to get a headache. and you only get fumes when you detonate a charge or a series of charges. you also need a blasting cap and a battery to send an electrical charge to set it off. usually a couple hundred feet of wire between you and the battery and the charged sticks is a good idea.

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 06:02 PM
skiracer
Your expertise is appreciated. I also am unaware of any legitimate explosives licensee or permittee that would leave explosives lying around. For one thing it is illegal not to mention all the civil liability issues. You simply know better. I believe most of what is being found was actually obtained back when the laws were much more relaxed or of course the explosives were obtained illegally. As an explosives licensee, permittee or possessor under Federal Law you had a background investigation conducted not to mention states require you to be certified as a blaster. I misread your post. I am not certain how safe putting a chew of dynamite in your mouth would be unless you are just joking? Did I read that correctly? The caffeine was my choice. We are probably getting a little off point for a gardening forum. As long as people understand the potential dangers it is a good thing.

skiracer
February 13th, 2011, 06:24 PM
skiracer
Your expertise is appreciated. I also am unaware of any legitimate explosives licensee or permittee that would leave explosives lying around. For one thing it is illegal not to mention all the civil liability issues. You simply know better. I believe most of what is being found was actually obtained back when the laws were much more relaxed or of course the explosives were obtained illegally. As an explosives licensee, permittee or possessor under Federal Law you had a background investigation conducted not to mention states require you to be certified as a blaster. I never used the chew of tobacco idea. I have also never used tobacco products so the caffeine was my choice. As long as people understand the potential dangers it is a good thing.

you're absolutely right about the legal issues. you would definitely leave yourself open to criminal and civil charges and lose your license and the privilege to work. it is a hard license to obtain and you have to take the test and pass it, work several years as a apprentice or powder monkey learning to drill the holes, know the explosives and caps, and alot of things about the different types of rock, water in the ground and a host of other things to numerous to list here before they will let you take the test. then you have to have someone sponser you and guarantee that you have a job to go to before you get that piece of paper. and you have to keep on top of the changing rules and regs and depending on the state they can test you anytime they want especially if there is some time between jobs. when you are not working the license goes back to the state and is given back to you when you start another job. if you are not working and have some company guaranteeing that you are employed at the time you try to obtain the explosives you wont have the license in your possession and without the piece of paper no explosives or caps. they dont take it lightly and they will take your license from you in a heartbeat if they feel you are in violation of your states rules and regs. and they want a thorough documentation of every cap and stick that you obtain and what you did with it and be ready to prove it with a daily documentation of what you did with what you purchased. not only yourself but the outfit that you are working for will be liable. every hole that is loaded, every cap and stick that is charged and set off has to be accounted for by a state licensed inspector before every shot and he has to sign off on having inspected and approved every shot or series of shots.

Ezzrider
February 13th, 2011, 07:00 PM
skiracer

You are correct but I believe the issues or problems are with untrained, unlicensed persons who come across explosives materials. They may be completely unaware of the potential dangers and legal issues. You and I know the problems but maybe they do not. That was the reason for my post to help out the unaware. I am relatively new to gardening and I have asked a lot of gardening questions on these forums that experienced gardeners probably consider very basic questions. They have all been very generous and understanding with their responses to me. This is an area in which I have some expertise and just wish to return the favor to those that may be unaware or uninformed concerning the dangers of explosives they may find. It is not all that uncommon for someone to run across old explosives especially old dynamite in rural areas. Thanks for your input.